S9 Ep25: The Busy Parents’ Partner: Wholesome Alternatives to Kids’ Midday Meals with Lisette Howard and Katy Tucker
“There are a lot of no's… you just keep knocking, and you will eventually find the people that believe in what you're doing and not where you are in that exact moment.” —Lisette Howard
“There's a lot of flash-in-the-pan products out there that hit the market fast as all they're gone… It’s really important to know your end game right when you start.” —Katy Tucker
Feeding our little ones can be a constant battle— between picky palates, busy schedules, and the overwhelming options on grocery shelves. But what if we could provide our kids with snacks that not only satisfy their cravings, but also nourish their growing bodies? The future of kids' food is clean, simple, and deliciously nostalgic.
Sunnie is a mission-driven snack brand dedicated to upgrading snack time for busy families. Co-founders Katy Tucker and Lisette Howard are on a mission to provide better-for-you options that never compromise on taste or convenience.
Tune in as Justine sits down with Katy and Lisette to discuss their journey in revolutionizing the snack industry, the importance of clean ingredients, and their plans to bring more wholesome choices to families nationwide.
Connect with Katy & Lisette:
With a background in online marketing, Lisette brings a strategic and innovative approach to building Sunnie’s brand and reaching health-conscious consumers. As a mother of three, Lisette understands the challenges of finding snacks that both nourish and delight children. Through Sunnie, Lisette is on a mission to provide families with better-for-you options that never compromise on taste or convenience.
With a background in fashion, Katy Tucker brings a unique perspective to the food industry, focusing on creating products that are not only nutritious but also nostalgic and appealing. As a mother of three, Katy is passionate about empowering parents to make better choices for their children's snacking needs. Through Sunnie, Katy aims to redefine the snack landscape and inspire a healthier future for families.
Connect with Feel Sunnie:
Episode Highlights:
01:44 Bridging the Market Gap in Kids’ Lunch
06:51 Navigating the Business Landscape During COVID
10:31 Pitching and Fundraising Challenges
14:46 Target Partnership
18:56 Distribution and Expansion Plans
24:21 Future Plans for Feel Sunnie
Tweets:
Busy schedules and picky eaters don't have to mean sacrificing nutrition. Listen in as we uncover snacks that nourish growing bodies without compromising taste as @jreichman sits with Sunnie co-founders, Lisette Howard and Katy Tucker. #podcast #entrepreneurship #socialgood #inspiration #impactmatters #NextGenChef #EssentialIngredients #Season9 #Sunnie #healthykidsfood #cleansnacksforkids #wholefoodskidslove #packablelunchideas #schoollunchinspo #kidsfoodrevolution
Inspirational Quotes:
01:22 “Our mission is to bring clean, easy-to-read products to market for busy families on the go.” —Katy Tucker
02:22 “The landscape hadn't changed in the last 30 years for our kids. And so the mission and the reason that we exist is to give our kids a better option that still felt fun, but updated the ingredients in a way that we felt good about.” —Lisette Howard
03:10 “People's attention toward better quality products for their households is not on the fringe any longer. People care what's on their label.” —Katy Tucker
07:39 “It's always easier to go in [entrepreneurship] knowing what you don't know because by knowing nothing about the industry, we felt more compelled to change it.” —Lisette Howard
08:36 “People tend to think that things happen overnight. It takes a little while.” —Justine Reichman
13:42 “There's a lot of flash-in-the-pan products out there that hit the market fast as all they're gone… It’s really important to know your end game right when you start.” —Katy Tucker
17:06 “Our customers are our number one fans.” —Lisette Howard
17:59 “There are a lot of no's… you just keep knocking, and you will eventually find the people that believe in what you're doing and not where you are in that exact moment.” —Lisette Howard
20:52 “Your distribution plan boils down to the buyers and where the buyers see your company sitting in their store. It goes all together.” —Katy Tucker
Transcription:
Justine Reichman: Good morning, and welcome to Essential Ingredients. Today, I have the great pleasure to welcome Katy Tucker and Lisette Howard, Co Founders of Sunnie.
Welcome ladies. I'm really pleased to have you here. I know what your product is. Guests don't know yet, so I'd love for you, before we dig in, to just share with them what Sunnie is in 30 seconds or less, right? Because we'll dig into the other stuff through conversation, but just so they get the idea. The high level.
Lissette Howard: We're like, who's gonna get start?
Justine Reichman: Okay, Katie, tell us what is Sunnie?
Katy Tucker: Sunnie was born out of necessity. We're two moms on a mission to upgrade snack time. Sunnie is a pre-packaged snack that some may like a Dunkaroo or a Lunchables. But our products are all made with super clean, simple ingredients that are made with just like nothing, but the best stuff. So we don't use any refined sugars, we don't use any seed oils, we don't use any gluten, so those are the reasons why we exist. But really, our mission is to bring clean, easy to read products to market for busy families on the go.
“Our mission is to bring clean, easy-to-read products to market for busy families on the go.” —Katy Tucker
Justine Reichman: I love that. Lisette, maybe you can share with us a little just to tap on to what Katy said. But what was the inspiration behind this? I know you're both mothers. I know you both have children. I know you met that way. What were you looking at that inspired you to create this product, or these products?
Lissette Howard: Katie and I both have three kids all under the age of 11. And for us, we met in a baby group when our eldest were two months old. But as our kids started going to elementary and we were making lunches. I personally despise making lunches. It's not my favorite thing. But as we started talking about what was on the market for our families, we kept coming back to the fact that, for us, we could get sushi, a salad at a grocery store. Baby food was available in the refrigerator. And for our kids, it was like a Lunchable or a meat and cheese tray. And we couldn't believe that the landscape hadn't changed in the last 30 years for our kids. And so the mission and the reason that we exist is we wanted to give our kids a better option that still felt fun, but updated the ingredients in a way that we felt good about. So that's really the premise behind it. That grew outside of the lunch box that we call it, and it's really for anybody. We call it the whole Modern Family. Anyone in the household grabs it, and they just feel good about what they're grabbing.
Justine Reichman: It sounds amazing. I love the fact that you've tapped into making something gluten free and vegan, and all these different things. Why did you think that was important?
Katy Tucker: I think I'll take that one. We see the marketplace kind of shifting, and I think we can all agree with public policy. People's attention toward better quality products for their households it's not becoming that thing that's on the fringe any longer. It's more pervasive. In American society, people care what's on their label. And it's not just like the macros, the protein and the fiber. It's more about what's actually on the label? What is the ingredient? Go back to your podcast, just Essential Ingredients. But it is important to people, and we as parents felt like there weren't enough products in the market that actually address that growing concern that families have. When I pick this label up, I don't know what half the things are on this label when they're at the grocery store and wondering why a lot of pre-packaged American food products are full of just stuff that we don't know. And people tell us a lot that our ingredient panels read like a recipe, like the crackers are made with five ingredients. Everything is simple, meant to be that way. It's made with real food, and that's really the gap we saw. We're like, hey, wait a minute. Nobody's doing this. And why? And the reason why is because it's hard. And we'll get into that because it's not easy to do what we do.
Justine Reichman: So when you put together these recipes, and they really do run the gamut from a snack to a dessert, in my opinion, which can still be a snack, right? It's just sweet or savory, I guess. How did you guys come up with the recipes? Did you work with a recipe developer? Do you guys have a background in that? I know Katy, you are in fashion. And Lisette, you did online marketing. Maybe food was a hobby. I'm curious, how did you drill down to get those really well balanced healthy recipes for the skews?
Lissette Howard: I'll take that one, and there's a few pieces to it. So one, Katy and I, our hobby is food. We naturally love food, cooking it,going to dinner, all of the above. So deep passion, and just the love for food. And then we also worked with a pediatric nutritionist and a recipe developer. So for us, it was really important that when we were putting together the products, that was like balanced nutrition. There was never too much sodium, or too much one or the other. We really wanted it balanced for that meal time moment. And then we worked with the recipe developer. We kind of all worked together, but we wanted all of our products to have a very nostalgic feel to them. We wanted that when you eat a pizza, it would be like, oh, I remember eating something like this 30 years ago. When you eat the cocoa spread, oh, I remember this in a different format. So for us, that's kind of how we've picked what the flavor profiles are. And then we work together with both the pediatric nutritionist and our recipe developer to meet all the guidelines that we had in place.
Justine Reichman: It was funny, when I picked up your products, they were nostalgic to me. There was something, and I can't put my finger on it. That had cheese on the one side when I was child, because I'm going to that I'm just a little bit older. But cheese on one side, and crackers on the other. And then from the Japanese market, there were these other cookie things, and then you stick them in the chocolate, which is also reminiscent of Nutella ish. But that's where my head went, and I totally remember those things like it was yesterday.
Lissette Howard: Yeah, me too. It's a real inspiration for us. We want all of our products to always have that feel of when you bite into it, you're like, I know this taste. I remember this.
Justine Reichman: The other one reminded me of a pizza bagel, although it wasn't on a bagel. But the idea of a pizza bagel, because 100 years ago, we used to get the little ones that were frozen. Probably not terribly healthy, and you'd stick them in the toaster and eat that. Now you've built that, you came up with this idea. It's COVID. You're going direct to consumer, and neither one of you had ever been an entrepreneur before. What was that journey like to then kick this off knowing you've never done it before? It's a crazy time in the world, and it's expensive and challenging.
“It's always easier to go in [entrepreneurship] knowing what you don't know because by knowing nothing about the industry, we felt more compelled to change it.” —Lisette Howard
Lissette Howard: I think a lot of us in the food industry, now that we've made friends, always joke that it's almost better that we didn't know about the industry because you might have some hesitations. It's always easier to go in knowing what you don't know. Because I think that knowing nothing about the industry, we felt more compelled to change it. And so one of the things that we experienced very early on that a lot of entrepreneurs experience is like, you can't do that. No, you can't put these three things in a package together. It doesn't exist. You have to do it this way. We're like, we don't want to do it that way. We want to do it this way. And so I guess we'll call it being a little hard headed in terms of, we had a vision for what we wanted to do, and we just did it. We just kept hitting the pavement, and reaching out to people that we thought would be experts that maybe led us the wrong way, or other experts that led us the right way. But it was really just continuing to knock on doors until we got the answers we wanted. And we proved that we could do it. We took the longer road, I'd say.
Justine Reichman: Well, I think that people tend to think that things happen overnight. Because all of a sudden, you hear of them where you're like, oh, this is brand new. It just came out. Well, no, they've been working on that for eight years, and it was out. It's just now getting recognition and being accessible. Whereas before, they're lacking resources, or being small, or new, etcetera. It takes a little while.
Katy Tucker: I will say one other comment about your question, Justine, because I think it's actually a comment and a compliment to Lisette. She has gut feelings about things, and it was like 2019, COVID was like 2019 going into 2020, and we had just started really putting our money into the company, and hired a brand agency. We were developing the brand, the product, everything, and COVID hit in March. I remember talking to her on the phone and thinking, Lissette, I think we should just hold it. I think my intuition was like, wait a minute. Lisette said something super interesting. Literally, I think about it to this day and she says, Katy, this is the one thing right now in a very dark time that's making me feel happy inside. And I think we should just try to do this right now because I think it's going to make other people really happy to see something in the market that is sunny and full of light. I'm really glad you know she had that feeling. She's right. I'm glad we started when we did, even though it was a hard time.
Justine Reichman: I can imagine, and it's a hard time to start it. It's a hard time to create a new path because it was unchartered territory. So even if you did it in the industry, you'd have to figure out how to re navigate it. Because it was a supply chain, people didn't want to touch things, people didn't want to go to the store. It was just completely different. The way that you went about it, you avoided having to pay for space on the shelves too, and it became more common practice back then to go direct to the consumer in some ways. I think it allowed people to do things in a new way, and gave people the ability to be successful.
“People tend to think that things happen overnight. It takes a little while.” —Justine Reichman
Katy Tucker: Definitely.
Justine Reichman: So now that you're in the CPG market, and I'm sure there's a lot of people in this market. There's startup CPG, there's all these different organizations that provide amazing resources, support and network. What do you think is the greatest thing you got by being part of some of these communities in your journey?
Katy Tucker: Lisette, you want me to answer that one?
Lissette Howard: Sure, you can start.
Katy Tucker: The top number one thing that changed for Sunnie was in 2022, so it was almost two years ago. December 22, we went to the Nosh Live Pitch Slam. We got invited to their Pitch event. And at that time, we were super uncertain about what we were going to do with the company. We were underfunded. We were trying to grow, but it was hard. We had crumbs in our bank account, and we weren't sure. We were literally not sure what we were going to do. We got invited to Pitch, and we thought, okay, well, this is a great opportunity. This seems like something we would actually like to do. So we get there and we're mixing it up with all these new people we'd never met before. And lo and behold, we win the Pitch competition. And honestly, Justine, that was a like, if there's a certain point in the company, that was a turning point in the company for us because it gave Lissette and I the confidence to not only continue, but to realize that there is a gap and a need in the market. It's not just us seeing it. It's a lot of other people.
Justine Reichman: Wow, that's amazing. And so when you were going to this Pitch contest and you were preparing for it, was there any hesitation? Were you concerned? Did you know how to Pitch?
Lissette Howard: No, we watched a lot of Pitch videos, to be honest. We watched a lot of pre Pitch videos. We saw their decks and we had our own deck, but we just put it together. We really focused on our why. Why did we exist? Why we needed to fill the gap, and then our distribution plans. But we really just focused on, what was the mission of the company? But it was a lot of research on how we do this.
Justine Reichman: And so if another Founder came up to you and said, okay, I'm working on my Pitch. What are the top two things you think are most important so that I can successfully pitch my company? What would you say?
Lissette Howard: I would personally say to really focus on why you exist in the market, and why you're different. That's the big thing that we still get asked today because we're always pitching to people, what makes you different? Why are you going to stand out on the shelf that'll make consumers want to pick you up? That, at least, is my number one advice. Katy, I don't know if you have something.
Katy Tucker: 100% agree with that. Know your WHY. Why do you exist? And in addition to knowing your WHY, why do you have a durable business idea? Because there's a lot of flash in the pan products out there that kind of hit the market fast as all they're gone. How is it that you're changing for the long term? How you can exist and ultimately get it look for an exit or a plan forward for yourself. How are you different in that respect? I think that's really important to know your end game right when you start.
Justine Reichman: Did you guys get feedback on your Pitch on why you won? What made you guys stand out from their perspective?
Lissette Howard: It was more of the innovation and idea behind it. One of the judges on the panel was Patrick Schwarzenegger, and he has his own product. One of his comments was, I remember just recently telling somebody like, why has nobody updated the Lunchable game? Because that's a lot of times what we get kind of compared to, is launchable. So for us, it was both the white space that we were actually going after, and then product taste and quality.
Justine Reichman: That makes a lot of sense. So now that you have won this and you realize this at this point, or where in the process, did you guys decide to bootstrap or raise money for the company?
Katy Tucker: While we wanted to raise money, it was really hard to do that. In early 23, it was hard so we ended up bootstrapping. We just hobbled along for a little while, and then we started, actually, I don't think I know. In March of 23, I remember because it was my birthday, I was sitting remembering Lisette. I was sitting at the spa or something fabulous for myself, and got the email from Target. Target says, you got your item numbers. You're going into stores later this year. I think that was about the time where Lisette and I called each other on the phone. We're like, okay, we've got Target. It's going to put us in 200 stores later this year. It's time to think through how we professionalize the product, update manufacturing, the labels, everything. Let's go for it. And that's really what started, I will say, this next chapter of the company. It was like a thrust moment where we were like, all right. If Target's saying yes, that's a very good indicator to investors and others that we had been talking to, and that just started to bring a lot more interest toward us, whether it was funding, advisory, all that good stuff.
Justine Reichman: And so did you then go look to raise money?
Katy Tucker: Yes, yes, we did. So we started raising later that year, and we started bringing in some dollars. Maybe you want to talk about this because your idea, about the crowd raising from our customers.
“Our customers are our number one fans.” —Lisette Howard
Lissette Howard: We did it in a different way. So 2023 is when we started the raise. As you know, we started in COVID. We've always been against headwinds, right? Meaning, the industry changed for funding so there weren't as many dollars going out. We were pitching, and we were pitching. And one of the challenges for us was like, you're too early, we want to wait. You're too early, we want to wait. And we got that a lot. And as we were coming to holiday time, we're like, why don't we just bring this up to our customers? Because our customers are our number one fans. Anyways, they've already tried the product. They love the product. And so we did open up like a friends and family round to our customers to be able to get involved, and we did raise some capital that way. That was kind of the propeller to that fundraise, and then we were able to secure some bigger partners within that raise, and close it in the earlier part of 24.
Justine Reichman: So that was your first time raising money. Are there any tips that you might share to other Founders that were useful for yourself or that you learned looking back?
Lissette Howard: We got feedback very early on from other founders. I'll never forget somebody being, once you get to 100 conversations, then you'll start to see the yeses. It's like, 100 conversations? You've got to be kidding me. And we have the Excel sheets to prove it. There are a lot of no's, a lot of no's, and I think that's back to being an entrepreneur and just you just keep going. One door closes and you just keep knocking, and you eventually find the people that just believe in what you're doing. Not like where you are in that exact moment, but your vision and the plan of what the product and the company can become. They are out there. You will find them. But I agree with the previous feedback. It's 100 plus conversations at least to start really getting traction.
Justine Reichman: Amazing, though. Congratulations. What a big milestone that is. So now that you're in Target, where else have you been able to solidify, because I would imagine that that was just the beginning of what was to come.
Katy Tucker: I'll talk a bit about the distribution. So the Target deal, it started in October of 23. So we've been on the shelf for about a year now, and that was a huge other demographic of customer that we were able to speak to which has been, and continues to be a great win for Sunnie. But we also knew that we wanted to penetrate natural and specialty, because we wanted to win her over in equity, building grocery stores like Whole Foods, Sprouts and other natural stores, because we were a unique product. They don't carry Lunchables. The biggest issue getting on the shelf in Sprouts and Whole Foods was people didn't know where to put us in the store. Whereas easy for a conventional store be like, oh, you sit near the Lunchables. That makes sense to them, so it really boils down to persistence. I think obviously, Lisette shared about the conversations it takes to fundraise that same type of persistence and tenacity is what it took for us to get the buyers at Whole Foods and Sprouts to take calls with us.
“Your distribution plan boils down to the buyers and where the buyers see your company sitting in their store. It goes all together.” —Katy Tucker
And at that time, we did not have any brokers helping us to make this happen. We were still a team of two trying to get those people on the phone. I will say that Whole Foods took us. We actually just put the dippers onto the shelf last week. Oh, and that took four years of conversations, and we have the emails to prove that it took that long. But I think in particular with Whole Foods, I do believe that they want to invest in emerging early stage brands in the right way, at the right pace, and they do a good job of incubating that. So we're excited to get the shelf space in Southern California looking for more. We have to see how it goes, but we're looking for more. And so that's a great win for us. We also launched into Sprouts Farmers Market earlier this year, a buyer relationship that came together with that account. But again, it boils down to where it goes on the shelf. They put us in the dairy set, in the yogurts, which we're starting to learn isn't a great place for Sunnie. Sunnie needs to be in other places. So all of this to say is that you know your distribution plan and what you want also boils down to the buyers, and where the buyers see your company sitting in their store goes all together.
Justine Reichman: So currently, you have a variety of different little packages. I'm wondering, what does it look like for the future of Sunnie? Are you looking to expand that? If we look at the next three to five years, what can we expect from Sunnie?
Lissette Howard: Yeah. That's my favorite topic because I do a lot of R&D in my own kitchen. You'll continue to see that we really want to build out that refrigerated set of fresh snacks. So what I mentioned earlier, like nostalgic flavors, think about other nostalgic flavors you haven't seen from us yet, those are in the pipeline. And then we're also looking at building a bigger format. So if you see our snack box, it might be larger, so it fits a whole bunch. So there's a lot of ideas and innovation that we have coming out in the pipeline in the next few years.
Justine Reichman: Exciting. So for those folks, whether they live in California or elsewhere, where can they find your product?
Katy Tucker: We're very focused in Southern California, so I'll call it the SOPAC region right now, so SoCal, Arizona, Nevada, Utah. You'll find us in Whole Foods there. You'll find us in Sprouts. You'll find us in Bristol Farms, Erewhon, those types of specialty stores. And we are working very, very hard on getting distribution. Oh, actually, Justine, I know you're in Northern California. We just launched at Nugget market this week.
Justine Reichman: We gotta get it to Woodlands too. That's my go to market.
Katy Tucker: So Northern California is key. We want to really get Northern California going, also the Pacific Northwest. We have some accounts that are going to launch there early next year, and then really looking at New York.
Justine Reichman: I was going to say, what's going on with the Right coast? I'm just kidding. Yeah, the East Coast.
Katy Tucker: We're working on Wegmans for the East Coast. That would be an anchor account. We'd love to see Sunnie out there. We've got some good distribution plans, but really trying to focus on natural specialty, get it cooked in, and then move into more conventional stores.
Justine Reichman: When you say little specialty stores, there's also a bunch of really healthy, good specialty stores in New York. The hungry Mart or something like that, and then there's also somewhere in Tribeca. I can't remember the name.
Katy Tucker: We're at the GoodMart.
Justine Reichman: I'll look up the other one for you. Those are the ones that came to mind when you were saying that you wanted to be in that market. I'm sure I come up with others, but those are the ones that I shop for. I think that they lend themselves. People know that they're going for something that's healthier there because it's a better for you snack.
Katy Tucker: Yeah, it does. It does well in those stores, for sure.
Justine Reichman: When you say Southern California, are you guys completely organic?
Katy Tucker: We're in Erewhon. They were one of our first accounts. Our product is not 100% organic. Organic avocado oil would break the company's bank. Remember that we use avocado oil.
Lissette Howard: Yeah, we focus on as many organic ingredients as we can that make sense for us, and then where it makes sense to not do it. Katie said regular avocado oil, but we do our research on choosing which ones we use.
Justine Reichman: That really ties into the Essential Ingredients Podcast because my goal is not to tell people what to do, but to give them information, your insight from others so people can make more informed choices. That's really the goal. To give founders like yourselves that platform to inspire others to create, change the narrative for people. I love what you're doing. I love how you're focused on these better for you products, it's making me want to go to the fridge to see if I have anything left. Where else could I see them? Not that you asked me to brainstorm with you because you did not, but I'm thinking airlines.
Lissette Howard: Yes, they are on our list. So we've been having conversations, and we agree. For us, we've talked a lot about a grocery store, but we really see the product shine on the go. Airports, airlines, convenience stores, hospitals--
Justine Reichman: Vending machines that are refrigerated have healthy snacks. So many options. So excited for you guys. I can't wait to see you guys when I go to the SFO airport and I can pull one down. I may have to wait till I go to Southern California next week for Thanksgiving to pop into a shop to see them. But in the meantime, if anybody does not live in the north in Southern California or any of those areas you mentioned, are they still available online? I want to make sure that everyone has access. How would somebody that wanted to buy them online go about finding you?
Katy Tucker: Go to www.feelsunnie, F-E-E-L-S-U-N-N-I-E .com.
Justine Reichman: Wonderful. Katy, Lisette, thank you so much for joining me today. I'm really excited to see your product explode in so many different ways, in so many different places. And when you have more things that you're trying out, I'd love to continue to try them, so keep me posted. Wonderful to follow your journey. Continue to follow your journey, I should say.
Lissette Howard: Thank you so much. You'll be our official taste tester.
Justine Reichman: I can't wait. I'm now going to say that that's part of my bio. I like that. So for those of you watching the podcast or listening to the podcast, I should say, don't forget that you can tune in to our videocast on YouTube at NextGen Purpose. This is the Essential Ingredients videocast. For those watching this, don't forget that you can listen to us on the go, wherever you listen to your podcasts. Don't forget to like, subscribe and leave a review. That's the way we hear from you what you want to hear from us. So till next week. Thank you guys again.
Katy Tucker: Thanks, Justine.
